Tuesday, October 28, 2014
Ch.7: Christmas's Struggle to Understand
In chapter 7, the scene where Joe Christmas rejects Mrs. McEachern's tray of food by dumping it on the ground in the corner of his room seemed like an interesting event that conveyed much about Joe's beliefs in women. When I read this, I saw this scene as a way of showing the reader the refusal that Joe has to accept anything from a woman because, as with the dietician, he cannot understand the true motivations of women in general. I also found this quote about Joe Christmas to be very true in sense, "though he did not then know that, like the eagle, his own flesh as well as all space was still a cage” (pg.160). Since Faulkner compares Joe to an eagle in this quote, I believe that it is trying to say that his constant anger with himself and his surroundings is like that of a caged beast who just wants to be set free. He is pretty much an imprisoned child who is having such a troubling time embracing his self-identity. Joe's past can clearly be seen as such a painful memory that no matter how much he runs and tries to escape from it, he will never succeed in getting the release that he desperately yearns for.
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I never thought about it in that perspective. How Joe cannot trust women in general because of the dietitian I mean. It makes perfect sense , however; it then makes me question why he still ate the food ? I also agree with your explanation of the quote. It would explain why Joe is that way he is in the future.
ReplyDeleteI agree with your perspective. I think Joe might be angered at the fact that he never had a mother figure in his life. This lady comes along and tries to connect with Joe as if he were her son; yet, she stands back as his father is violent toward him. A real mother would defend their children beyond anything and anyone.
ReplyDeleteWow! I never realized this. I do agree that the event with the dietician may have led to his anger problems he has now as an adult. Although, I also believe that Mr. McEachern may have also influenced his aggressive ways with the example he is setting such as beating Joe Christmas.
ReplyDeleteI agree as well, Christmas's relationships with women have not been positive at all so far in the novel. It seems as if women are a different species to him.
ReplyDeleteI never thought of associating the comparison of the eagle to Joe's anger inside him, you bring up a good point. I also find it interesting how nearing the end of chapter seven, it is openly admitted that Joe would rather take the beating of a man than the niceness of a woman.
ReplyDeleteTo me that quote is powerful. When we read it I was just amazed. I agree that he would rather be beat by a man than take kindness from a woman. I think maybe it is because he has never had a woman in his life and does not know how to react to one being nice to him. Also he sees how McEathern is strong and stern so he may think that all men should be this way and acts like that.
ReplyDeleteThis reminds me of how he reacted to the "Womanshenegro". He does seem quite confused about women, and showing affection in general. When Mrs. McEachern tried giving him food it was also a sign of affection he could not understand.
ReplyDeleteI do not think Joe would take a beaten by a man but if I were in Joe's shoes I would be hostile towards Mrs.McEachern as well. Joe is constantly being brutally hit by Mr.McEachern and Mrs.McEachern does not do a single thing to change the outcome.
ReplyDeleteWow, your perspective upon Joe really opened up my thoughts about him. I know understand why Joe's association with any women would be so cruel and cold. He thinks that women are of a new species and can not comprehend them. He would act like how McEachern taught him, using violence. Also, Mrs. McEachern interaction towards Joe is showed less for she hides in the background and watches Joe being tortured, and that's why Joe would act so cold around her, for not helping him in need.
ReplyDeleteYour perspective on Joe denying woman had really opened up the way I view him as a character. If thats so then why once Mrs. McEachern left the room he shoved the food in his mouth? Can it be because he does not want to show any signs of being weak?
ReplyDeleteI think its because he didn't want to show Mrs. McEachern his gratitude for bringing him food which was much in need. He might have thought of showing his thankfulness as an act of weakness like you said, but also an act of giving in to a woman's actions, which in his mind are evil and hypocritical.
DeleteI feel that Joe was acting like any other teenager. No one likes to accept things when they're upset but once they realize they were wrong, they refuse to show sympathy towards the other person. So I see how Joe ate the food later on.
ReplyDeleteI think it was more on the point of rejecting sympathy or compassion because it was something that he was never exposed to before. I mean,yeah, he was a teenager, but that was just one factor of his whole situation. Human nature tends to rejects things that are new to us for some time.
DeleteI agree, this changed my perspective of him as a character. But I also think he did that because he is angry at her for not helping him.
ReplyDeleteI never thought that his resentment was toward women but now that you mention it, it is possible. I think it's not so much women but the way that Mrs. McEachern and Miss Burden treated him. They were affectionate and showed him compassion. He was unsure of what that was and how that felt. Since he was accustomed to suffering he felt that there was an ulterior motive driving the women to do good and that they'd eventually do him wrong. Or perhaps he does not want to be pitied.
ReplyDeleteI never thought about comparing Joe's anger with Mrs.McEachern and his past experiences with the dietitian and having that contribute to his incapability to trust and understand women.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you because also when he was in the orphan the detrition tried to get rid of him so he may now see all women as bad.
DeleteI'll definitely agree that some of his issues with women stem from Ms. Atkinson- though I wonder if Alice had anything to do with it. She was his first mother figure, and she abandoned him without a trace. I suspect that his mistrust of women started there and got worse over time- having McEachern as a father figure probably didn't help.
ReplyDeleteI would've never thought about comparing him to a caged beast but I completely agree with you his history with women could make him act out this way he doesn't have a mom and the incident with the dietitian as a young boy he already has this image of a women being a horrible person so when mrs mceachern tries to be nice and sympathetic he cannot believe it and he doesn't no how to accept it. - Alexandra Perez
ReplyDeleteLike Randy and Yesenia shared was surprising, haven't thought about it that way before. He is the eagle caged by society but also himself and struggling for self identity.
ReplyDeleteI like where you were going with this Randy. But the fact in chapter 8 how he had an opportunity to escape his cage, much like Lena, and run off into night. I also like how you brought up the dietician & him not understanding the motivates of the females. That was the first women he had relations (not the most finest 1st relation)with ever, she could of influenced something to him about women in some way possible.
ReplyDelete